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Old 06-08-2009, 03:23 PM   #1
majiksmom
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Be the Pack Leader by Cesar Milan

I have read several of Cesar Milan's books and I also watch and record all the episodes of The Dog Whisperer. I just learn so much from him and his books keep you interested. I recommend any of his books. Thanks for letting me share.
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Old 06-08-2009, 04:15 PM   #2
Labman
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Too bad much of what you are learning is the best available now. It may work in many cases, but other things work better. While I agree leadership is the key to dog behavior, his harsh methods are not called for.
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Old 06-08-2009, 05:23 PM   #3
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*sign* Ya know I'm tired of Ceasar... I just went through 700+ posts in a thread about the dude and watched a video about him nearly suffocating a dog.... he and his methods are just overrated All I'm going to say, I'm sticking with Dunbar, Weston, and Pryor (my favs)

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Old 06-08-2009, 06:07 PM   #4
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im sticking to common sense and trial and error, i dont agree with some of his methods, if i pinned charlie down he would freak out completely. and he keeps harking on about being the alpha and keeps relating dogs to wolves *yawn* no thanks
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Old 06-08-2009, 06:58 PM   #5
grizzle
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I think it's GREAT that you have found someone that has touched you and helped you learn about dogs. It doesn't matter who it may be , Dunbar, Weston, Milan, stilwell, they all have one thing in common they love helping dogs. I have never really seen Cesar train a dog to do anything. He helps dogs overcome problems and helps them fit in to our society. More power to anyone that can do that. Thank god for dogs...people and there better than thou attitudes suck!!!
If dogs could train humans it would be a perfect world!!!
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Old 06-08-2009, 07:01 PM   #6
Labman
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jr_K9_Expert View Post
*sign* Ya know I'm tired of Ceasar... I just went through 700+ posts in a thread about the dude and watched a video about him nearly suffocating a dog.... he and his methods are just overrated All I'm going to say, I'm sticking with Dunbar, Weston, and Pryor (my favs)
+1

Same thing on another forum I am on. I have no idea how many posts in the thread about CM, E collars and rattlesnakes.
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Old 06-09-2009, 01:31 AM   #7
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I am with you Junior. However, if Cesar gets people interested in training their dogs...then the next step is for them to do their homework and really learn about dog behavior and the people that are available to them to help train them to train their dogs.
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Old 06-09-2009, 04:30 AM   #8
Labman
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To a degree that may be true. Nothing wrong with spreading the idea dogs can and should be trained.
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Old 06-09-2009, 02:29 PM   #9
BetterDog4U
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Book Review:
I found the book to be mostly just a review of his TV episodes. (Probably ment to get you to watch the show!!!) The only thing that was new was in the back of the book. It had some "What to Do If ..." ideas.

Comments: (Sorry, it's kinda long)
I agree with K9, if his show gets ppl interested in training that can only be a good thing!!! I've been working with several ppl who watch him, and after talking with them and explaining that Cesar uses the word "Dominance" when he should be using "Strong Leadership" the lightbulb usually goes on.

As I've said in several past threads, I think his philosiphy of Exersize, Training, then Affection is the cornerstone to a well adjusted dog. That and the fact that you need to show strong leadership to your dog!

From that point on, I don't agree with heavy-handed "dominance" traning. It just is not effective in most normal cases. He works with A LOT of "Red Zone" cases and he gets results b/c he uses "flooding" or simply overpowers the dog ... While this works in the short run, he never spends enough time explaining that the owner MUST continue to spend a lot of time working with the dog, taking it for long walks and doing a lot of obedence training.

I've worked with a few dogs that have had some serious problems and to be fair they were not what he would call "Red Zone". I may not have gotten "instant" results like CM, but I have a 100% rate of sucess. It took 1-4 months in most cases.

One dog that suffered from fear aggression, took me just 4 one hour sessions to get her more comfortable around new ppl. 4 months later she still has some issues with "first time" meetings but she doesn't go blistic when they walk by her any more. After she meets them once, (is allowed to smell them from a distance and be around them without them going near her) the second meeting goes with no problem. The key was to get ppl to pay NO attention to the dog and allow her to come to them on HER terms. Once she realized that ppl were not going to hurt her and that they had lots of treats in their pockets ... she was fine with it!!! Over the course of the past 2 months, the owners have had 20-30 ppl come by with treats in their pockets.
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Old 06-10-2009, 06:14 PM   #10
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Well lets look at it another way...yes it is awesome that he has gotten the word out that dogs can and should be trained. Granted. The way that this is being done however cancels out any positive gain it might have gather for the reason that (even with disclaimers that few listen to) many people try his methods for dogs that don't require the aversive methods.

Millan's ability to read body language is exceptional which makes his timing great. Unfortunately when people (who don't even come close to his observational skill) try his methods you end up with some serious problems of miscommunication AND possible injuries.

Now that he has gotten much acclaim (not usually from the dog savvy communities, might I add) and has gained popularity he should shift this TV shows to more "average joe" cases so that people can take care of their problems at their levels. This way he does get the word out and people aren't generally using methods that are too extreme for their own cases. If people think that he does a great job with Red Zone cases the ok, by all means he should continue to do so but not showing the public how he deals with them because these cases are best left to behavioralist.

Lets take that video I was talking about earlier, if you guys want to watch it here is the link:

http://channel.nationalgeographic.co...ideos/05198_00

This is a classic example of what I just explained above. Millan avoid serious injury by being ready when the dog is going to jump and avoiding the bite, yet even with his observational skills he still gets his shirt ripped and scratched. Now what happened if someone seeing the show tried to the same thing? The most likely thing is that with the lack of observational skills or knowledge in canine body language, the viewer wouldn't have been able to dodge the bites effectively, most likely leading to a serious injury and a possible trip to the hospital and (depending the state) the destruction of the aggressive dog.

Then there is also the questionability of the results and understanding of the dog owners...The problem in the video is not solved, it was forced stopped by the lack of oxygen of the dog. In the end of the video the owners talk about "redirrecting" the problem...this shows the lack of understanding because the problem was neither redirrected nor solved it was just simply momentarily subdued.

I just don't like the attitude this sort of training this is instilling in those that think they have learned about dog behavior by watching his show...I mean someone told me that Coprophagia was a demonstrating of dominance....according to ceasar....really since when?!?!
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